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WWCephas

Silent Hunter III is a must have

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This game rocks, and is very addictive. It also is for me a Single Player game that I enjoy, which is a rarity. I generally prefer multi-player games.

I spent the entire weekend patrolling the North Atlantic while also watching the History Channel. I may need to file an extension on taxes because I can no tsee taking time to do them now that I have this. :P

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hehe, addictive isn't it.

i was cruising to my designated grid when i get hit by a shell in a storm.

i crash dive then come back up to periscope depth, and see that it's a merchant with a gun.. first one i have come across.

THE HIDE i think and decide to take it out.

well.. 5 torpedos wasted later it's STILL floating.. i give up and cruise off.

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I just picked up SHIII over the weekend, and I'm not quite as addicted...yet. I like the fact that it's heavily involved and you really have to plan you actions, and and think about the consequences that may occur because of your decisions.

Bard had me laughing last night when he said he was envisioning sinking a ship that he observed pulling into Vancouver Harbor. I remember playing Gran Turismo for the PlayStation when it first came out, and then hopping in my car and driving like a bat out of hell. I was pissed that everyone else was driving so slow. /applications/core/interface/imageproxy/imageproxy.php?img=%7BSMILIES_PATH%7D/icon_wink.gif&key=940dab18e6395dabf49383a0bb376331df53e6f1880bab3f9e4e80745a8cc9ca">

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hehe, yeah.

sitting in an office overlooking the harbour when i see this container ship passing.

before i knew it i had already plotted my intercept course in my head before catching myself /applications/core/interface/imageproxy/imageproxy.php?img=%7BSMILIES_PATH%7D/icon_biggrin.gif&key=64cd7b7a0036899205810ec0a5b90ed7121d5889dd92733089c47c9758b7f4ae">

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Bringing up your periscope in the middle of a huge convoy at night is like being a kid in a candystore with 5 bucks in your hand. God forbid I find another convoy in smooth water, there is bound to be an escort now and I know I will be so tempted to try and hit the destroyer first.

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OK, got the game and installed it on my son's machine. I felt the game may be cool enough to risk him having to rebuild his machine because of Starforce. ;-)

OK, in general the tracking of ships and lining up your shots is pretty cool. I like the dynamic nature of the missions. The good:

The ability to manually track a target and operate the TDC. Correlation, the ability to let the computer do it for you if you don't have the long play time available to do the tracking properly.

Graphics are good for the most part.

Signs of life at the ports with people walking around. Good step for the atmosphere but it would be nice to see other ships in dock or maybe some of the other subs in the pens. I know they aren't there but even a couple of static ones would help.

BUT...I'll list out my problems with the game...

Like a lot of titles this one has some issues. Some are outright bugs and some are just hard to explain why they would do this.

Broken outright: save games. I haven't discovered the exact pattern but TWICE I've saved a game that just disappeared. The second time it happened it said the war had ended in 1942. Going back to a previous save worked but when I hit April of 1942 the war ended again. The whole save game and delete all saves after a restore is a FUBAR design and implementation.

Weapons Officer: Had Germany had WO's that could compute perfect firing solutions in less than a second like this game they would have won the war by 1942 (which as stated above they apparently think they did).

Bad Design/Implementation: Locked at 1024x768? Please, I didn't realize it was 1995 all over again.

Deck Gun: They weren't used that often because a sub is a very unstable platform. As a finishing weapon on a wounded ship yes. Being able to sink an entire convoy with one is ridiculous. Short of multiple destroyers at a time you can sink pretty much any ship with hella accurate deck gun fire at 7000 meters. I've relagated myself to only letting untrained seamen operate the deck gun to make up for it being the Uber weapon it is. At first it seemed bagging 152,000 tons in one sortie and still have fish left was cool but it really got boring.

Flak Gun: Not being able to use the deck gun during winds greater than 7 is understandable. Not for the flak gun. It's up on the same tower my bridge crew is standing on why can't they use it?

Missing incremental rudder controls. I can do hard right or hard left and amidships, but am limited to the mouse to set a heading or minor rudder set? Scratch doing a comprehensive voice command set with VAC. I've figured out how to execute some of the various officer commands by manipulating the commands_en.cfg file but I shouldn't have too. Should have had a pop-up box for this for numerical input.

Missing wolfpacks: what is the point of making contact reports to HQ? You are the only U-Boat in the sea (aside from a couple fishing boats and a Type 34 destroyer outside of Wilhelmshaven I seem to comprise the entire German Navy). No wolfpack combat on a convoy ala Aces Of The Deep. You are on your own. This ranks up there with no torpedo planes in PF. Well, more like if they had also left out dive bombers and carriers in PF.

Crew Management: What an utterly tedious feature to have. The fatigue rate is like something out of the Twilight Zone. Actually, it's broken. If in Nav map view and accellerating to 1024 they don't fatigued at all. Go to normal mode and you are lucky if the poor bastards can work a 2 hour shift without needing a 3 week vacation in the Bahamas.

That is until they get a Popeye dose of a medal that acts like Spinach and they can work for 5 days straight.

I like being ABLE to manage the crew. I hate HAVING to manage them to the nth degree. This is micromanagement to an insane scale. I'm betting some of our Navy vets can attest their CO never tucked them in at night and woke them in the morning. It should have an option to delegate that to an officer.

No certs for Seaman: can only cert petty officers and officers. Sailors had specialities as well...here they are fatigue fodder. There seems to be little reason to waste renown on officers or crew at any level that don't have certs. Resilence seems to have a little to do with but one set of Sub wings and that is no longer a factor.

No need to dive deep: Most subs escaped by diving deep and using inversion layers and such to escape. Going below 20 meters in this game just gets you tracked and killed far too easy. At the other extreme if you stay at 20 meters or above ships lose you completely. Aircraft, which should be able to spot you easily unless you are really deep seem to be blind if you are as shallow as periscope depth.

For grins I decided to play Rambo Sub for a bit. Stay at peri level until a destroyer was at a bad angle to shoot me. Emergency blow, man the deck gun and 3 shots later he is sinking. Cool, lets cruise around. 6 armed trawlers, 3 flower corvettes and 4 V&W destroyers later I just shut it off. Only had taken 15% damage. I can play around this weakness though by limiting myself to not doing this kind of stuff but it really lessens the "threat of impending doom" feel you would expect from a sub getting a depth charge hammering.

Compressed Air: Doesn't appear to be used in the game. Running out doesn't seem to suffocate your crew or prevent you from blowing emergency tanks. You can even fire your torps when it's empty. Seems to be a disconnected part of the game.

OK, rant over. I hope they address some of this in the 1.2 patch. It's a much better sim than SH2 but honestly it is missing a lot of what a game like AOD great. The elements are there but it seems unfinished.

(Edited for typos)

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I don't have the game, so the following comments are based on Sensei's review.

7,000 meters is about 3.5 nautical miles. The 5" deck gun on a WWII destroyer had a max rage of 5 miles. That was on a much more stable platform.

By wind 7 I am assuming Sensei means Force 7 on the Beaufort scale. That means winds of 28-33 Kts. Just short of full gale. Having spent some years at sea on ships ranging from 210' to 1,050' I can state that a manualy manned gun on a surfaced submarine will have zero accuracy in that sea state. Especially against aircraft. I would refrence the movie "The Boat" if any one needs help visualising the effect of weather on a U-boat.

The Captain of any ship I ever sailed on could have cared less if I was tired. Just find away and do the job sailor. You sleep when and where you can. I've fallen asleep crouched down in a chow line with my back against a bulkhead. While fatique may effect preformance of a crew, the proper way to reflect it would be superior prefomance for a rested crew. The fact of life is that the crew of a ship, on a war time footing, will always be fatiqued.

Not trying to be critical of the game. Just bringing some real world observations into play. We all know that a good game is not neccesarily the most realistic, and true realism does not always make a great game.

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Sensei posts some vary valid points, although I find the game to be quite enjoyable.

As for target solutions I was under the impression that the periscope is slaved to a mechanical targeting computer, thus making solutions very quick, the identifying process (to include specifically range and speed) is what is too quick. That is unless the Germans actually used laser range finders as one of their "Sekret Weapons" back then. :P

I find the destroyers detection ability more disturbing for gameplay though. I wish I had not read Sensei's post on how they can not detect you very well at periscope depth as before that I was always diving deep and trying to maneuver away in silent running.

As for some of the other points,
Crew management can be tedious, I like setting ratings and such and crew assignments before I leave harbor, but it is silly to waste time on it at sea, except perhaps a whole crew morale/endurance rating that affects performance. Having your engine stop running during evasive maneuvers because your engine crew is too tired is inane.

Medal assignment is just silly, I have the Iron Cross with oak leaves swords and diamonds already in the Summer of 40, Rudel will be a common soldier compared to me if I go much longer. Many of the Iron Cross add-ons did not even come into existance until late in the war.

Destroyers kick my ass on the surface, I don't know how Sensei took one out with the deck gun. As for the deck gun being too powerful I disagree, the early war saw widespread use of the deck gun and it was the PREFERRED weapon for sinking ships when it was employable. $500 dollars worth of shells versus $100,000 torpedo was a no brainer. The early war was a time of the "Happy Hunting Grounds" when the Kriegsmarine acted with near impunity even along the caost of the Eastern US, sinking ships right offshore. Now the fact that I found an unescorted convoy in the middle of the night within UK coastal waters has me wondering whether early convoys might have been left unescorted in reality, I no longer find them to be unescorted after that one event. The destroyer escort is now pretty aggressive in protecting the convoy and I don't tempt fate trying to take on the DD first. I am hoping as the war progresses that the escort becomes more difficult to penetrate.

Graphics wise, yeah its locked at 1024 but it looks great even on my widescreen lcd screen which is strange because if it is truly running at 1024 which is not my native res it should be stretched and pixelized from not being run at native res.

The save game thing is weird, why erase saves after an autocomplete at the beginning and end of a mission?

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According to subsim.com, the 1.2 patch is now out, although it doesn't appear to address many of the issues Sensei lists.
I haven't had the save game problems Sensei has, but I had noticed that destoryers have trouble detecting you at periscope depth. I had written that off to poor early war ASW procedures on the Allies part, but it could be more than that I guess.

1.2 Changes and Additions


SHIPS & AIRPLANES DAMAGE SYSTEM
Improvements in collision and damage model have been made for several ships:
Liberty Cargo
C2 Cargo
T2 Tanker
T3 Tanker
Tug Boat
LST
CAMPAIGN DATA
Netherlands properly enters and exits the war now
Gdansk is now renamed Danzig when under German control
Added mine fields and anti sub nets
INTERFACE
Local time displayed (under the current date) when the mouse is over the current hour (bottom-right corner) in game; this local time will depend on the U-Boot position on Earth (which is divided in 24 slices having 15 longitudinal degrees each)
Game version displayed in the bottom-right corner of the main menu page
Data from notepad (top-right section in periscopes or UZO pages) will not be reset on expert mode when the target in view is changing
A new tool: Angle tool (protractor) on navigation map
No weapon officer assist option (a new option in difficulty settings); when this option is checked then the Identify target and Solution to target orders from Weapons officer will be disabled
Wound badge fixed (when drag & drop)
WEATHER SYSTEM
Solved issues related to rain on time compression (rain will not became invisible after long time compression sessions)
A more balanced weather system
GAME EDITOR
Solved Game Editor crashes related to terrain data, mission objectives and triggers
IN-GAME
Solved the black sun problem and environment texture errors
The escorts will now make evasive maneuvers while pursuing contact (depending on the crew skill)
MULTIPLAYER
Ready button issue was fixed
Message box issues
The interface to servers list has been slightly updated to reflect the version of the game server and also to show if the server is password protected
The crash that is happening when chatting in session menu has been fixed.
Other minor updates

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could it be that when you are nearer the surface it's more difficult for the hydrophones to find you in the rest of the surface noise?

i found that an asdic equipped destroyer was pinging the crap out of me and hunting me down while i was at periscope depth. I had to dive to over 100 metres and rig for silent running while going slow or even stopped to lose it.

i've read a few posts of game save issues with 1.0 users - i'm using 1.1 and haven't seen any problem myself.

the crew handling interface can use some improvements - for example - you should be able to assign blue and gold crews and swap the whole lot over. I would very much like another bunk for the officers too...

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Heh, with all the activity in this thread, I just had to run out and see if this was still around.

I remember a buddy of mine having this quite awhile back and being dissapointed after we installed on my machine.



Isn't SH3 the game that was advertised as being able to "hook-up" to some new Destroyer game released at or close to the same time?

Anyway, you guys sounded like you were having fun with it, and being a big fan of SH1 and 2 back in the day -- I thought I'd give it another look.



What luck!! ONE COPY at the store, and bargain binned for 19 bucks! -- hmmm....but it's opened...... :?

The guy at the store said they do that for "theft protection". Guess they dont mind if a theif steels the box...but whatever... :shock:

I brought it home and My system couldnt even read the darn disc!!! -- I WAS FLAMING!!! /applications/core/interface/imageproxy/imageproxy.php?img=%7BSMILIES_PATH%7D/icon_evil.gif&key=36bc05a3863f15788b23d585f469a280df42babbcc58b8301d709f526041b146">

...then I humbly saw the "DVD CD-ROM" sticker on the box and said - Doh! /applications/core/interface/imageproxy/imageproxy.php?img=%7BSMILIES_PATH%7D/icon_redface.gif&key=b30c314ea10c72f3d32953a265be0c32a1435b472bb99313e5e3656e23efc144">

...so I bought a DVD player ('bout time I should prolly have one anyway eh?) /applications/core/interface/imageproxy/imageproxy.php?img=%7BSMILIES_PATH%7D/icon_wink.gif&key=940dab18e6395dabf49383a0bb376331df53e6f1880bab3f9e4e80745a8cc9ca">



Time for the tutorials, but the meat and potatoes of this post was supposed to be --

So fellas, hows the multiplayer on this sim? Anyone tried it yet

Guess I got a little side-tracked eh?

- WWBrian

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multiplayer frankly.. sucks.

it's not that it isn't capable, but it could get boring real quick.

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SH3 is a brand new release, it was SH2 that was supposed to hook up with the surface vessel game. SH3 is $30 new, so $20 for a used copy is not bad. Multi is limited to coop attacks on scripted missions. Could be fun every now and then on well made missions. Multi-player also needs to be hosted through UBI, not direct peer to peer.

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SH3 is a brand new release, it was SH2 that was supposed to hook up with the surface vessel game. SH3 is $30 new, so $20 for a used copy is not bad. Multi is limited to coop attacks on scripted missions. Could be fun every now and then on well made missions. Multi-player also needs to be hosted through UBI, not direct peer to peer.


Thats right! SH2 was the one! Hooking up with what was it,....Destroyer Command I think.

Maybe I was thinging about SH1 and Wolfpack or something. One was German one was Allied, the other game from long ago was GATO. Im not thinking of that Im sure...LOL.

I'll play around with the mission editor I saw.....see if I cant make one of those "well made" missions or two, don't hold your breath though - Hah! hold your breath, subs...oh nevermind.... /applications/core/interface/imageproxy/imageproxy.php?img=%7BSMILIES_PATH%7D/icon_rolleyes.gif&key=1e8c06ab12fb541f5359109fc2a9aa78454b8063e7aa8862e992af3163d7b4b4">

-WWBrian

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